Typical corp I suppose. But really, like they don’t have enough money! How about a cool artsy movie theater?! Or a teen center or …so many other options!
Or a roller skating rink! Sales taxes, cool place to hang out for all age groups (could offer 21+ nights like many rinks do, with or without alcohol), and Boulder County doesn't have a single indoor roller skate rink. But alas, another fitness place it is...
It’s an impression, I’d like some facts. Every current retail space that would serve as a future grocery store has been filled and will be, as in this case, with a non-retail entity. This has occurred over decades, I am a resident since 1982. I’d like to grocery shop locally but it is increasingly difficult to do. Vitamin Cottage and Sprouts are options and I shop there, but they are limited in offerings. And this space is too small to go over the reasons why I will not shop in the new Erie/Lafayette Kroger store. And did the City of Lafayette approve that nightmare parking lot/pedestrian crossing nightmare? So many questions, so little time. 🙂
"So many questions, so little time. 🙂" I feel ya there! I can help with some if you can give me a bit of time as I have to work. LOL I have some, if not all, of the info you seek but I will have to track it down. I will go back to your previous comment with the numbered questions. Knowing you have been here since the 80's helps me!
What nightmare parking lot/pedestrian crossing nightmare are you referring to?
When trying to leave the store, both occasions visiting Lowe’s and King Soopers we had to be on high alert as cars were heading for us, no stop signs allowing us to cross. Haven’t been back, so hopefully it is safer now. And there were no clear lanes for cars visiting small shops on the north and west sides. It’s like the Wild West in that parking lot. Thrills are fine, but they have their place! As, you’ve probably picked up, I miss the wonderful town that Lafayette used to be. Although the one grocery store in Lafayette old town had steep sloping floors. Let go of your cart and you had to chase it down. LOL
Ah you are talking about Erie, that is all their work. Lafayette has no input into anything like that in that plaza. We just have an agreement regarding sharing sales taxes.
I've been here since about 1987 or so, seen a lot of changes. I remember going to Boulder every weekend to get groceries. The store that was at the end of the old Sister Carmen building on E Simpson was closing. There was a warehouse-type grocery store where the bowling alley is now, was it Alco? That closed quite quickly too.
I'm hearing similar comments! But if you live in Lafayette you might consider what I wrote to someone on Nextdoor who said they were going to shop at Safeway because they were angry at King Soopers. I'm not happy either and have no plans to shop there. File this under nothing is easy. :-D
If you shop at the Nine Mile Kings Lafayette gets half of your sales taxes to help fund the running of our city. If you shop at Safeway Lafayette gets nothing and Erie gets it all to run their city. If you can buy what you need in Lafayette (or online) not only does the city get all the sales taxes you pay we also get money to fund our open spaces and parks via two sales taxes dedicated for that. Plus money to fund our public safety services and mental health and human services.
I don't know if you've posted this before, but King Soopers has a Community Rewards program & the Friends of the Lafayette Library is one of the orgs you can choose. You have to have an online account, though. Then Friends will get some kind of contribution based on all your KS purchases, no matter what store you're shopping at, as long as you use your member card.
On the face of it, this appears to be poor planning on the City’s part. I have several questions to determine if this is the case:
1. Didn’t Kroger receive financial incentives to come to the City?
2. If incentives were given, and Kroger now appears to have sole discretion on which tenant can lease the property, why was this allowed? - there will now be 5 fitness centers within a 6 mile radius of my address.
3. The City has now filled every former grocery store building with a non-retail tenants. First the old Albertsons/Walmart buildings and now this.
Should I file an open records request with the City or is there another way to get this information?
As I said in response to your second comment which is not appearing in this thread, I'll try to answer your numbered questions.
1) The city, with Gary Klaphake as city administrator had an economic development agreement with King Soopers to build in that location. Back in the day I asked him about eco dev deals in general because he was doing quite a few of them and he gave me a list.
Here's what it says for Summit Marketplace the King Soopers plaza
"King Soopers
• Sales Tax rebate agreement to build shopping center
• Opened 5-15-04
• Year 1 - $301,672 rebate; Year 2 - $100,557 rebate; Year 3 - $75,000 rebate •
Note that sales tax rebate year is from date of opening and does not track with calendar year
Summit Marketplace All new Included above"
So that agreement was to allow King Soopers to keep some of the sales taxes they collected over a period of time. That was the financial agreement in order to cover some of the costs of developing the plaza. I might have the actual agreement but will have to dig more, it's possible I have a paper copy in a file. I can't remember that far back!
Elisabeth, our discussion is not following in a threaded manner so it's really hard to keep it going. When you read this would you might replying to this comment and not the original post? That should keep the flow working better. Otherwise there is no continuity. Thanks!
On to your 2nd point " If incentives were given, and Kroger now appears to have sole discretion on which tenant can lease the property, why was this allowed?"
Kroger, or its parent company owns the building. We might have helped them with some upfront costs via the EDA but unless that agreement said we could tell them who they could lease to, it's over. Why would any company agree to such a stipulation? There might have been some shorter-term requirements but it's been 20 years now.
Keep in mind we didn't enter into that EDA for King Soopers benefit, it was to get them to build a store in that location. We sweetened the pot to coax them here or they might have built elsewhere. This is what corporations do, they play neighboring communities off each other.
And yes I am ticked off that we did that deal with them and now they have walked. But there is only so much the city can do. Kings wanted a larger store in a different location and there was Nine Mile waiting with open arms. I don't know if they were offered a deal from that developer or Erie but it was in the cards years ago.
I was hoping for something a little more…interesting, I guess? The lack of substantial sales tax revenue will undoubtedly be missed, but it beats a vacant building.
I too was hoping for something more interesting. This is not a place I will ever enter. ;-) I was hoping for something that would generate sales taxes.
Yes Karen, that was Alco. I shopped there too for a time. My memory is a little fuzzy, but I recall Albertson’s moving in where the church is now, within a year or so of the Alco closure. We’ve seen quite a few changes over the years, some very good. Thanks for clarifying the King Soopers incentives. They got a great deal! I appreciate all the work you do to keep us informed!
Oh I heard the eye roll, I thought it was a clap of thunder. :-) If they sell the land a business that sells the same type of merchandise might buy it. Can't have competition can they? Weird though I started shopping there when they first opened in Lafayette so around 20 years, I stopped going in May and haven't been to the new store so they lost my business. I am sure I am not the only one. But again they don't think in terms of long-time customers, loyalty, or anything else in that vein.
Kroger had to have done their homework and concluded the very same thing, made the very same assessment, so this probably has more to do with corporate reporting to shareholders, and ledger reporting of property holdings, than anything to do with revenue potential (and certainly NOTHING to do with value to our City or to its residents)!
It seems similar to the multitude of tire places. Are you going to buy more tires because there are more stores? Are you going to go to additional fitness centers because a new one opened? Exercise more often? It seems like just a transfer from one place to another. Wouldn't one eventually have to give and close due to lack of customers? I don't know, I never go to any of them. ;-)
...and won't another fitness biz potentially take away from the city rec center revenue? our city certainly doesn't have the town's best interests in mind when making these decisions. just glad it's not another mega-church I guess!
It could but it's probably a lot more expensive to go to this new one. The city didn't have anything to do with Kroger deciding to put a fitness business in their vacant building. City staff tried to get them to work on a public/private partnership of some kind but were rebuffed. As long as the zoning code is met Kroger can lease that building to whatever business they want and sadly they selected this one. There was no decision made by the city.
Ughhh another fitness center!!!!
Thats so disappointing. 😕
I agree.
The lack of imagination is disheartening. That will be 3 mega gyms within a mile of one another. Seriously, bonkers.
I agree. Kings went for the business that would offer no competition at all.
Typical corp I suppose. But really, like they don’t have enough money! How about a cool artsy movie theater?! Or a teen center or …so many other options!
So many other better choices but they don't care about the city.
Or a roller skating rink! Sales taxes, cool place to hang out for all age groups (could offer 21+ nights like many rinks do, with or without alcohol), and Boulder County doesn't have a single indoor roller skate rink. But alas, another fitness place it is...
And a very large fitness place too.
One could make an argument that roller skating is a form of fitness! So it could still be a fitness location, just hip, ha.
Haha you are right!
Gosh let's do stocks and bonds!!! You are 👍 great
Lame. The exact business that this community did NOT want. 👎🏼👎🏼
Sure is one I don't want. So far I have not heard anyone say yeah!
It’s an impression, I’d like some facts. Every current retail space that would serve as a future grocery store has been filled and will be, as in this case, with a non-retail entity. This has occurred over decades, I am a resident since 1982. I’d like to grocery shop locally but it is increasingly difficult to do. Vitamin Cottage and Sprouts are options and I shop there, but they are limited in offerings. And this space is too small to go over the reasons why I will not shop in the new Erie/Lafayette Kroger store. And did the City of Lafayette approve that nightmare parking lot/pedestrian crossing nightmare? So many questions, so little time. 🙂
"So many questions, so little time. 🙂" I feel ya there! I can help with some if you can give me a bit of time as I have to work. LOL I have some, if not all, of the info you seek but I will have to track it down. I will go back to your previous comment with the numbered questions. Knowing you have been here since the 80's helps me!
What nightmare parking lot/pedestrian crossing nightmare are you referring to?
Your offer to help is very kind.
When trying to leave the store, both occasions visiting Lowe’s and King Soopers we had to be on high alert as cars were heading for us, no stop signs allowing us to cross. Haven’t been back, so hopefully it is safer now. And there were no clear lanes for cars visiting small shops on the north and west sides. It’s like the Wild West in that parking lot. Thrills are fine, but they have their place! As, you’ve probably picked up, I miss the wonderful town that Lafayette used to be. Although the one grocery store in Lafayette old town had steep sloping floors. Let go of your cart and you had to chase it down. LOL
Ah you are talking about Erie, that is all their work. Lafayette has no input into anything like that in that plaza. We just have an agreement regarding sharing sales taxes.
I've been here since about 1987 or so, seen a lot of changes. I remember going to Boulder every weekend to get groceries. The store that was at the end of the old Sister Carmen building on E Simpson was closing. There was a warehouse-type grocery store where the bowling alley is now, was it Alco? That closed quite quickly too.
The parking lot is a mess & it's a pain if you want to exit & go south. I'm about to become a Safeway shopper or drive to Louisville.
I'm hearing similar comments! But if you live in Lafayette you might consider what I wrote to someone on Nextdoor who said they were going to shop at Safeway because they were angry at King Soopers. I'm not happy either and have no plans to shop there. File this under nothing is easy. :-D
If you shop at the Nine Mile Kings Lafayette gets half of your sales taxes to help fund the running of our city. If you shop at Safeway Lafayette gets nothing and Erie gets it all to run their city. If you can buy what you need in Lafayette (or online) not only does the city get all the sales taxes you pay we also get money to fund our open spaces and parks via two sales taxes dedicated for that. Plus money to fund our public safety services and mental health and human services.
I don't know if you've posted this before, but King Soopers has a Community Rewards program & the Friends of the Lafayette Library is one of the orgs you can choose. You have to have an online account, though. Then Friends will get some kind of contribution based on all your KS purchases, no matter what store you're shopping at, as long as you use your member card.
https://www.kingsoopers.com/i/community/community-rewards
PS - The parking lot is still terrible but I've come to like the store & the curbside pickup area is really spacious!
I haven't mentioned that rewards program. I know a few local groups are part of it.
Thanks for reporting that you are getting used to the store and like it! Your last report sounded like you were heading to Safeway. 😊
On the face of it, this appears to be poor planning on the City’s part. I have several questions to determine if this is the case:
1. Didn’t Kroger receive financial incentives to come to the City?
2. If incentives were given, and Kroger now appears to have sole discretion on which tenant can lease the property, why was this allowed? - there will now be 5 fitness centers within a 6 mile radius of my address.
3. The City has now filled every former grocery store building with a non-retail tenants. First the old Albertsons/Walmart buildings and now this.
Should I file an open records request with the City or is there another way to get this information?
And many thanks for the update!
As I said in response to your second comment which is not appearing in this thread, I'll try to answer your numbered questions.
1) The city, with Gary Klaphake as city administrator had an economic development agreement with King Soopers to build in that location. Back in the day I asked him about eco dev deals in general because he was doing quite a few of them and he gave me a list.
Here's what it says for Summit Marketplace the King Soopers plaza
"King Soopers
• Sales Tax rebate agreement to build shopping center
• Opened 5-15-04
• Year 1 - $301,672 rebate; Year 2 - $100,557 rebate; Year 3 - $75,000 rebate •
Note that sales tax rebate year is from date of opening and does not track with calendar year
Summit Marketplace All new Included above"
So that agreement was to allow King Soopers to keep some of the sales taxes they collected over a period of time. That was the financial agreement in order to cover some of the costs of developing the plaza. I might have the actual agreement but will have to dig more, it's possible I have a paper copy in a file. I can't remember that far back!
I'll be back to answer more later!
Elisabeth, our discussion is not following in a threaded manner so it's really hard to keep it going. When you read this would you might replying to this comment and not the original post? That should keep the flow working better. Otherwise there is no continuity. Thanks!
On to your 2nd point " If incentives were given, and Kroger now appears to have sole discretion on which tenant can lease the property, why was this allowed?"
Kroger, or its parent company owns the building. We might have helped them with some upfront costs via the EDA but unless that agreement said we could tell them who they could lease to, it's over. Why would any company agree to such a stipulation? There might have been some shorter-term requirements but it's been 20 years now.
Keep in mind we didn't enter into that EDA for King Soopers benefit, it was to get them to build a store in that location. We sweetened the pot to coax them here or they might have built elsewhere. This is what corporations do, they play neighboring communities off each other.
And yes I am ticked off that we did that deal with them and now they have walked. But there is only so much the city can do. Kings wanted a larger store in a different location and there was Nine Mile waiting with open arms. I don't know if they were offered a deal from that developer or Erie but it was in the cards years ago.
Let me start with your initial comment and ask you why you think this is poor planning on the city's part.
I was hoping for something a little more…interesting, I guess? The lack of substantial sales tax revenue will undoubtedly be missed, but it beats a vacant building.
Thanks for the reporting!
I too was hoping for something more interesting. This is not a place I will ever enter. ;-) I was hoping for something that would generate sales taxes.
You are awesome... for providing this info. 👍
I know people have been waiting. I heard the news and got going on a post right away!
Yes Karen, that was Alco. I shopped there too for a time. My memory is a little fuzzy, but I recall Albertson’s moving in where the church is now, within a year or so of the Alco closure. We’ve seen quite a few changes over the years, some very good. Thanks for clarifying the King Soopers incentives. They got a great deal! I appreciate all the work you do to keep us informed!
Oh my gosh Karen, this info is amazing. I am a retired CPA, so please let me know if I can help with any financial research.
And I'm guessing they don't want to sell the property to a buyer with more creativity?
They indicated to the city pretty quickly that they wanted to retain ownership of the building. They want to control what goes there.
You probably can't hear me eye rolling over here, but I find that epically frustrating. Just sell the plot of land.
Oh I heard the eye roll, I thought it was a clap of thunder. :-) If they sell the land a business that sells the same type of merchandise might buy it. Can't have competition can they? Weird though I started shopping there when they first opened in Lafayette so around 20 years, I stopped going in May and haven't been to the new store so they lost my business. I am sure I am not the only one. But again they don't think in terms of long-time customers, loyalty, or anything else in that vein.
I agree. No creativity.
They were looking for a tenant that best suited their needs not the residents of Lafayette.
I agree.
Thank you.
Kroger had to have done their homework and concluded the very same thing, made the very same assessment, so this probably has more to do with corporate reporting to shareholders, and ledger reporting of property holdings, than anything to do with revenue potential (and certainly NOTHING to do with value to our City or to its residents)!
For sure value to our city was not part of the consideration.
Really? I can't imagine any of the multitude of fitness places being profitable, but they must be.
It seems similar to the multitude of tire places. Are you going to buy more tires because there are more stores? Are you going to go to additional fitness centers because a new one opened? Exercise more often? It seems like just a transfer from one place to another. Wouldn't one eventually have to give and close due to lack of customers? I don't know, I never go to any of them. ;-)
...and won't another fitness biz potentially take away from the city rec center revenue? our city certainly doesn't have the town's best interests in mind when making these decisions. just glad it's not another mega-church I guess!
It could but it's probably a lot more expensive to go to this new one. The city didn't have anything to do with Kroger deciding to put a fitness business in their vacant building. City staff tried to get them to work on a public/private partnership of some kind but were rebuffed. As long as the zoning code is met Kroger can lease that building to whatever business they want and sadly they selected this one. There was no decision made by the city.
Very good to know. I've been wondering who would fill the space. Thank you for being on top of this!
A lot of us have been wondering along with you!